Bowman Leaves Detroit

Tunnel © wrote:
> "owl" <churchsl RemoveThis @hotmail.com> wrote in message
> news:6c03660f-a0bf-4446-a192-72701404d7e8@26g2000hsk.googlegroups.com...
>> http://www.tsn.ca/nhl/story/?id=244949&lid=headline&lpos=secStory_nhl
>>
>> Scotty gets the guru title Senior Advisor, Hockey Operations ...
>> for ... Chicago Blackhawks.
>>
>> They didn't say interim, so I'm guessing he'll last longer than
>> Flinch. But I wouldn't make or take a bet on it.
>
>
>
> Peddie strikes again. Bowman isn't good enough for MLSE..
> Right Richard?
>
> Tunnel.
>
>
>

Actually it was MLSE that was not good enough for Bowman...

http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2008/writers/allan_muir/08/01/bowman....lbag/in

...."While the Hawks seemingly can do no wrong in the Rocky Wirtz era,
Bowman's willingness to go to Chicago is another glaring example of the
ineptitude of the Maple Leafs. Rumors that Bowman wanted to run every
facet of the organization ring pretty hollow when you consider that the
74-year-old was hardly an everyday face in the Wings' offices. It's safe
to read his refusal to join the Leafs as a negative assessment of the
team's operation. Bowman, like all great leaders, likes to surround
himself with people who are just as committed to greatness. That type is
scarce -- maybe even extinct -- in the current Maple Leafs Sports &
Entertainment hierarchy."...

The Mad Ape
www.tatumba.com
 >> Stay informed about: Bowman Leaves Detroit 

"Mad Ape" <chiefape RemoveThis @gmail.com> wrote in message
news:g73uk2$vq9$1@registered.motzarella.org...
> Tunnel © wrote:
>> "owl" <churchsl RemoveThis @hotmail.com> wrote in message
>> news:6c03660f-a0bf-4446-a192-72701404d7e8@26g2000hsk.googlegroups.com...
>>> http://www.tsn.ca/nhl/story/?id=244949&lid=headline&lpos=secStory_nhl
>>>
>>> Scotty gets the guru title Senior Advisor, Hockey Operations ...
>>> for ... Chicago Blackhawks.
>>>
>>> They didn't say interim, so I'm guessing he'll last longer than
>>> Flinch. But I wouldn't make or take a bet on it.
>>
>>
>>
>> Peddie strikes again. Bowman isn't good enough for MLSE..
>> Right Richard?
>>
>> Tunnel.
>>
>>
>>
>
> Actually it was MLSE that was not good enough for Bowman...
>
> http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2008/writers/allan_muir/08/01/bowman....lbag/in
>
> ..."While the Hawks seemingly can do no wrong in the Rocky Wirtz era,
> Bowman's willingness to go to Chicago is another glaring example of the
> ineptitude of the Maple Leafs. Rumors that Bowman wanted to run every
> facet of the organization ring pretty hollow when you consider that the
> 74-year-old was hardly an everyday face in the Wings' offices. It's safe
> to read his refusal to join the Leafs as a negative assessment of the
> team's operation. Bowman, like all great leaders, likes to surround
> himself with people who are just as committed to greatness. That type is
> scarce -- maybe even extinct -- in the current Maple Leafs Sports &
> Entertainment hierarchy."...
>
> The Mad Ape
> www.tatumba.com


If Peddie wanted Bowman that badly, he would be running the Leafs as we
speak. Peddie does not want to give up any of his power with regards to the
Maple Leafs. Bowman wanted him to step aside and let him run the hockey
department from top to bottom.

Peddie refused and thats why Bowman is now employed by the Hawks.

Tunnel.
 >> Stay informed about: Bowman Leaves Detroit 

On Aug 3, 5:43 am, Mad Ape <chief... RemoveThis @gmail.com> wrote:
> Rumors that Bowman wanted to run every
> facet of the organization ring pretty hollow when you consider that the
> 74-year-old was hardly an everyday face in the Wings' offices.

Actually the job was advertised as a Colangelo-type addition. They
used the same Dallas search-firm with the same criteria, and Bowman's
name came out on top. Bowman stated he'd run the Org. It appears
there were issues about cost and attendance, but the real deal based
on the double cycle and death by delay has RPeddie's autograph on it.

> It's safe to read his refusal to join the Leafs as a negative assessment of the
> team's operation.

He didn't refuse. He applied ... twice. He was embarrassed the first
time (rattled his job in Detroit), and p.o.'d the second time - said
as much in the MacLean interview. The second time around was about as
unprofessional as an Org could get.

> Bowman, like all great leaders, likes to surround
> himself with people who are just as committed to greatness. That type is
> scarce -- maybe even extinct -- in the current Maple Leafs Sports &
> Entertainment hierarchy."...

Hard to say what Bowman's tenure might have been like. He was going
to keep JFJr on board; at least to the end of his contract. Perhaps
if he'd come on board early enough, he could have persuaded Craig
Button to stay or return, and he probably would have plucked up
Brunstrom before the headlines lit up. After that, who knows.

Instead of what might have been, the Leafs got the roughest ride
they've had since the Murphy era for sure, and even maybe comparable
to some of the Ballard excesses. They used up a first round plum to
buy out the goalie they got. They finally got a goalie so they mashed
up the D. They've got enough depth at left wing to build an
underground parking lot ... but they won't win many faceoffs. They
spent about as much money getting Flinch as the would have spent on
Bowman. And the strategy right now appears to be putting on a vile
display of hockey game in and game out - to get a 50-50 shot in
NHL649. Yea, this is the worst it's ever been - even in the Ballard
years the big problem was Hal's meddling trying to get a winner.
 >> Stay informed about: Bowman Leaves Detroit 

"Mad Ape" <chiefape.RemoveThis@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:g73uk2$vq9$1@registered.motzarella.org...
> Tunnel © wrote:
>> "owl" <churchsl.RemoveThis@hotmail.com> wrote in message
>> news:6c03660f-a0bf-4446-a192-72701404d7e8@26g2000hsk.googlegroups.com...
>>> http://www.tsn.ca/nhl/story/?id=244949&lid=headline&lpos=secStory_nhl
>>>
>>> Scotty gets the guru title Senior Advisor, Hockey Operations ...
>>> for ... Chicago Blackhawks.
>>>
>>> They didn't say interim, so I'm guessing he'll last longer than
>>> Flinch. But I wouldn't make or take a bet on it.
>>
>>
>>
>> Peddie strikes again. Bowman isn't good enough for MLSE..
>> Right Richard?
>>
>> Tunnel.
>>
>>
>>
>
> Actually it was MLSE that was not good enough for Bowman...
>
> http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2008/writers/allan_muir/08/01/bowman....lbag/in
>
> ..."While the Hawks seemingly can do no wrong in the Rocky Wirtz era,
> Bowman's willingness to go to Chicago is another glaring example of the
> ineptitude of the Maple Leafs. Rumors that Bowman wanted to run every
> facet of the organization ring pretty hollow when you consider that the
> 74-year-old was hardly an everyday face in the Wings' offices. It's safe
> to read his refusal to join the Leafs as a negative assessment of the
> team's operation. Bowman, like all great leaders, likes to surround
> himself with people who are just as committed to greatness. That type is
> scarce -- maybe even extinct -- in the current Maple Leafs Sports &
> Entertainment hierarchy."...
>

It wasn't a "rumour" that Bowman wanted to have complete control it was what
he told everyone he desired. Basically he wanted control over the hockey
operations and the Leafs didn't want to give it to him so he said that since
he was doing basically the same job for Detroit that MLSE wanted him to do
he saw no point in moving. Had the Blackhawks given Bowman that type of
power he wanted there would have been a parallel of sorts.

Stop going to SI for your hockey information.
 >> Stay informed about: Bowman Leaves Detroit 

On Aug 4, 4:51 pm, "Will" <w....DeleteThis@will.not> wrote:

> It wasn't a "rumour" that Bowman wanted to have complete control it was what
> he told everyone he desired.

Yea, that's what he presented to the Board.

>  Basically he wanted control over the hockey
> operations and the Leafs didn't want to give it to him so he said that since
> he was doing basically the same job for Detroit that MLSE wanted him to do
> he saw no point in moving.

The creaky hinge was Peddie's role. Bowman said it need Colangelo
structure - he goes straight to the Board. Colangelo had been so
successful in his first year with the Raptors that Peddie found
himself pushed out of the loop. So Peddie dragged the senior guru
concept around the arena. It died, with Bowman denying it publicly
and making nice with the Detroit Org privately. Tannenbaum was the
guy that revived it. Peddie dragged it around some more. And Bowman
got slimed.

>  Had the Blackhawks given Bowman that type of
> power he wanted there would have been a parallel of sorts.

Have you read any reports that outline Bowman's role in Chicago?
 >> Stay informed about: Bowman Leaves Detroit 

owl <churchsl DeleteThis @hotmail.com> trolled:
> http://www.tsn.ca/nhl/story/?id=244949&lid=headline&lpos=secStory_nhl
>
> Scotty gets the guru title Senior Advisor, Hockey Operations ...
> for ... Chicago Blackhawks.

Do you think Detroit would have let him go if he had anything left?
Do you think Toronto would have chosen Fletcher over Bowman, if
Bowman had anything left?

This is a step backwards for Chicago, assuming they can go further
back than hiring Savard as their coach...

cordially, as always,

rm
 >> Stay informed about: Bowman Leaves Detroit 

Come on guys, the stoop-and-scoop law has been adhered to reliigiously in
this NG for a long time now, who left this dogshit lying here?

Steve

<rm.DeleteThis@big.justlinux.ca> wrote in message
news:d84de$48984d65$cf7049f7$25353@PRIMUS.CA...
> owl <churchsl.DeleteThis@hotmail.com> trolled:
> > http://www.tsn.ca/nhl/story/?id=244949&lid=headline&lpos=secStory_nhl
> >
> > Scotty gets the guru title Senior Advisor, Hockey Operations ...
> > for ... Chicago Blackhawks.
>
> Do you think Detroit would have let him go if he had anything left?
> Do you think Toronto would have chosen Fletcher over Bowman, if
> Bowman had anything left?
>
> This is a step backwards for Chicago, assuming they can go further
> back than hiring Savard as their coach...
>
> cordially, as always,
>
> rm
 >> Stay informed about: Bowman Leaves Detroit 

In article <UJSdnfAJZcx-9grVnZ2dnUVZ_uadnZ2d
@comcast.com>, "Will" <will.DeleteThis@will.not> wrote:

>It wasn't a "rumour" that Bowman wanted to have complete control it was what
>he told everyone he desired. Basically he wanted control over the hockey
>operations and the Leafs didn't want to give it to him so he said that since
>he was doing basically the same job for Detroit that MLSE wanted him to do
>he saw no point in moving.

My understanding is that Bowman, as you say, wanted the same autonomy
as Colangelo.

Peddie said sure. In a subsequent meeting Bowman said he would clean
house. Peddie came back with Bowman would have to give JFJ an extension.
Scotty said seeya, Bowman ain't no fool.

Jim
 >> Stay informed about: Bowman Leaves Detroit 

"foamy" <bombelly.RemoveThis@sulet.ten> wrote in message
news:SLcmk.4474$%b7.1121@edtnps82...
> In article <UJSdnfAJZcx-9grVnZ2dnUVZ_uadnZ2d
> @comcast.com>, "Will" <will.RemoveThis@will.not> wrote:
>
>>It wasn't a "rumour" that Bowman wanted to have complete control it was
>>what
>>he told everyone he desired. Basically he wanted control over the hockey
>>operations and the Leafs didn't want to give it to him so he said that
>>since
>>he was doing basically the same job for Detroit that MLSE wanted him to do
>>he saw no point in moving.
>
> My understanding is that Bowman, as you say, wanted the same autonomy
> as Colangelo.
>
> Peddie said sure. In a subsequent meeting Bowman said he would clean
> house. Peddie came back with Bowman would have to give JFJ an extension.
> Scotty said seeya, Bowman ain't no fool.
>
No, but you seem to have a screw loose or two:

"I had good meetings with Toronto,'' Bowman told host Ron MacLean. "I had a
very strong meeting with Larry Tanenbaum (Chairman of the board for Maple
Leaf Sports and Entertainment) one day in mid-August. ... I was getting very
interested and then he said he wanted me to meet Richard Peddie (President
and CEO of Maple Leaf Sports and Entertainment) and I met Richard for an
hour a week later.''

Bowman said Peddie told him later that they had decided to keep things
status quo because it was three weeks before training camp.

"I had pretty well put my cards on the table with Toronto that for me to
come in it would have to be like a Bryan Colangelo type of deal (Colangelo
is president and general manager of the Toronto Raptors),'' Bowman said. "I
said the only way it's going to work for me would be a Brian Colangelo
situation. I think they might have been concerned about how much time I was
going to be able to spend, but I spend all my living time in hockey. ...
Even though I'm not behind the bench, I'm still 24-7 and I enjoy it.''

Bowman added: "I met most of the board members, I gave them my resume of
what I thought I could do, what I felt the blueprint would be. ... I put my
best foot forward.''

Asked by MacLean if he would take the job if offered to him after next
week's board meeting, Bowman said: "That's a pretty tough question to answer
right now because you're asking something that's real hypothetical. It would
be awful tough to leave Detroit (where he is a consultant) right now. That's
where I want to win. We'll cross that bridge if we get to it, though.''
 >> Stay informed about: Bowman Leaves Detroit 

On Aug 6, 2:35 pm, bombe....TakeThisOut@sulet.ten (foamy) wrote:
> In article <o5mdnSIscZrndATVnZ2dnUVZ_vGdn....TakeThisOut@comcast.com>,
>
>  "Will" <w....TakeThisOut@will.not> wrote:
> >> My understanding is that Bowman, as you say, wanted the same autonomy
> >> as Colangelo.
>
> >> Peddie said sure. In a subsequent meeting Bowman said he would clean
> >> house. Peddie came back with Bowman would have to give JFJ an extension.
> >> Scotty said seeya, Bowman ain't no fool.
>
> >No, but you seem to have a screw loose or two:
>
> Pfffft. Care to point out a single thing you posted which contradicts a single
> thing I said ?
>
> Jim

The two iffy's in your post I sniffed were: Peddie saying sure over
the Colangelo structure; and Peddie saying he had to give JFJr an
extension. The phrase these ears recall was Bowman saying "it'll take
$3mil less the cost of Ferguson" ... and I've always wondered which
interpretation would work best with that (including Peddie's reduced
role). It doesn't say you're wrong, but others have suggested that
was code for Bowman cleaning house. On the structure, iirc Peddie was
thinking he'd be in the loop for one more year ... and Bowman wanted
him to leap aside right away. From here, that was the real reason the
whole thing looked like a Shakespearean tragedy by the time it
curtained.
 >> Stay informed about: Bowman Leaves Detroit 

In article <o5mdnSIscZrndATVnZ2dnUVZ_vGdnZ2d.DeleteThis@comcast.com>,
"Will" <will.DeleteThis@will.not> wrote:

>> My understanding is that Bowman, as you say, wanted the same autonomy
>> as Colangelo.
>>
>> Peddie said sure. In a subsequent meeting Bowman said he would clean
>> house. Peddie came back with Bowman would have to give JFJ an extension.
>> Scotty said seeya, Bowman ain't no fool.
>>
>No, but you seem to have a screw loose or two:

Pfffft. Care to point out a single thing you posted which contradicts a single
thing I said ?

Jim
 >> Stay informed about: Bowman Leaves Detroit 

"foamy" <bombelly RemoveThis @sulet.ten> wrote in message
news:bammk.4513$%b7.200@edtnps82...
> In article <o5mdnSIscZrndATVnZ2dnUVZ_vGdnZ2d RemoveThis @comcast.com>,
> "Will" <will RemoveThis @will.not> wrote:
>
>>> My understanding is that Bowman, as you say, wanted the same autonomy
>>> as Colangelo.
>>>
>>> Peddie said sure. In a subsequent meeting Bowman said he would clean
>>> house. Peddie came back with Bowman would have to give JFJ an extension.
>>> Scotty said seeya, Bowman ain't no fool.
>>>
>>No, but you seem to have a screw loose or two:
>
> Pfffft. Care to point out a single thing you posted which contradicts a
> single
> thing I said ?
>
> Jim

As you can see from the article that the process never got very far, not to
the point of the Peddie saying "sure, you have the job" as you wrote . The
Leafs wanted a consultant, Bowman wanted more power and money to leave
Detroit, no deal. If you have a source for JFJ being brought into the
discussions, let's have it.
 >> Stay informed about: Bowman Leaves Detroit 

On Aug 6, 11:44 pm, bombe... RemoveThis @sulet.ten (foamy) wrote:

> My post was perhaps too condensed. It was drawn from a
> collection of news reports, radio and tv interviews etc which occurred
> over a period of time. I think what you said is basically correct, Bowman
> would have taken the job if he received certain assurances but Peddie
> when the rubber hit the road wasn't willing to cede control.
>
> Jim

Actually, between you, me, and Will, a lot of river bottom comes to
the surface but still doesn't have any closure. It's like a police
lineup in search of crime, eh? Was Scotty looking for a return to
active duty - or did the Toronto fiasco trash his relationship with
the Detroit Org.? Did Peddie delay the issue to death, or did
Tannenbaum go rogue on the process again? ... or neither or both?
 >> Stay informed about: Bowman Leaves Detroit