Is NHL one of the top four sports?

Diego wrote:
>
> I'm not from the United States and I have read about the low TV ratings, the
> financial problems and the lack of interest in NHL in the United States (I
> guess that not in Canada) but then I see the attendance figures and they
> seem very good. Media tend to show sports in a worst situation than the one
> they are in fact but anyway my question: in the United States do you think
> that NHL is one of the major sports or it's behind NFL, MLB and NBA? Please
> I'm only interested in knowing NHL's situation not the other sports'? Let's
> clarify something: considering that what I'm interested in is knowing aboput
> the entertainment industry part of sports I would like you to think that
> NASCAR, F1, Indy car and all those motor sports are included in the list, in
> addition please include College sports (not all as one but College football,
> college basketball, college baseball as different sports) and in baseball,
> you could include Minor Leagues too.
> Thanks.

http://www.sportsfansofamerica.com/Interactive/Editorials/Fans/Popularity.htm

Scroll down the page and you'll see that hockey is about as popular as a
chapped ass.
--
Jack


http://photos.yahoo.com/bc/xmissionbobo/
 >> Stay informed about: Is NHL one of the top four sports? 

While I've never heard of TV ratings for ass-chapping, didn't the Bruins
routinely scored lower in the Boston market on Saturday afternoons when they
played at 1pm...up against Candlepin bowling?

I also think popularity has a lot to do with economic factors within the
sport as opposed to participation in a particular sport...for example,
football is by far the biggest money making sport in regards to tv deals,
salary caps, less home dates resulting in routine sellouts and waiting lists
for tix, TV ratings (gambling plays a huge part in that area); yet, how many
people actually grow up playing football in many parts of the country (I
understand its religon in the southern states)...

Just a quick thought...which sport is more popular (through participation)
with kids these days...football or hockey? Although I am sure soccer is
blowing every other youth sport away...

Rich


"nJb" <bobo1148 RemoveThis @xmission.com> wrote in message
news:3F8D99FA.4126F5D2@xmission.com...
> Diego wrote:
> >
> > I'm not from the United States and I have read about the low TV ratings,
the
> > financial problems and the lack of interest in NHL in the United States
(I
> > guess that not in Canada) but then I see the attendance figures and they
> > seem very good. Media tend to show sports in a worst situation than the
one
> > they are in fact but anyway my question: in the United States do you
think
> > that NHL is one of the major sports or it's behind NFL, MLB and NBA?
Please
> > I'm only interested in knowing NHL's situation not the other sports'?
Let's
> > clarify something: considering that what I'm interested in is knowing
aboput
> > the entertainment industry part of sports I would like you to think that
> > NASCAR, F1, Indy car and all those motor sports are included in the
list, in
> > addition please include College sports (not all as one but College
football,
> > college basketball, college baseball as different sports) and in
baseball,
> > you could include Minor Leagues too.
> > Thanks.
>
>
http://www.sportsfansofamerica.com/Interactive/Editorials/Fans/Popularity.htm
>
> Scroll down the page and you'll see that hockey is about as popular as a
> chapped ass.
> --
> Jack
>
>
> http://photos.yahoo.com/bc/xmissionbobo/


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 >> Stay informed about: Is NHL one of the top four sports? 

I don't think this is the right forum to ask if NHL is the number 4 sport in
US... You'll get a biased answer as in YES it is..

If you go to another forum, the fans there will probably say NHL is like the
10th... It all depends on the audience you're asking... All you have to do
is go to all the news publications on the internet such as LA Times, NY
Times, Washington Post, etc etc and see where they place the NHL in their
column... that will give you a better indication...

R Green
Tech Support
--------------
WoWsat.com
--------------

"Diego" <arui30.TakeThisOut@cerezo.pntic.mec.es> wrote in message
news:bmjgfu$n8ku2$1@ID-112298.news.uni-berlin.de...
> I'm not from the United States and I have read about the low TV ratings,
the
> financial problems and the lack of interest in NHL in the United States (I
> guess that not in Canada) but then I see the attendance figures and they
> seem very good. Media tend to show sports in a worst situation than the
one
> they are in fact but anyway my question: in the United States do you think
> that NHL is one of the major sports or it's behind NFL, MLB and NBA?
Please
> I'm only interested in knowing NHL's situation not the other sports'?
Let's
> clarify something: considering that what I'm interested in is knowing
aboput
> the entertainment industry part of sports I would like you to think that
> NASCAR, F1, Indy car and all those motor sports are included in the list,
in
> addition please include College sports (not all as one but College
football,
> college basketball, college baseball as different sports) and in baseball,
> you could include Minor Leagues too.
> Thanks.
>
>
 >> Stay informed about: Is NHL one of the top four sports? 

Rich Reitman wrote:
>
> Just a quick thought...which sport is more popular (through participation)
> with kids these days...football or hockey? Although I am sure soccer is
> blowing every other youth sport away...
>
> Rich
>

Everybody who enjoys a chapped ass raise your hand. Nobody? Didn't think
so.

Soccer is #2, behind basketball.

http://money.cnn.com/2002/06/28/commentary/column_sportsbiz/soccer_popularity/
--
Jack
 >> Stay informed about: Is NHL one of the top four sports? 

On Wed, 15 Oct 2003 15:27:40 -0400, "Rich Reitman" <rreitman DeleteThis @cox.net>
wrote:

>While I've never heard of TV ratings for ass-chapping, didn't the Bruins
>routinely scored lower in the Boston market on Saturday afternoons when they
>played at 1pm...up against Candlepin bowling?
>
>I also think popularity has a lot to do with economic factors within the
>sport as opposed to participation in a particular sport...for example,
>football is by far the biggest money making sport in regards to tv deals,
>salary caps, less home dates resulting in routine sellouts and waiting lists
>for tix, TV ratings (gambling plays a huge part in that area); yet, how many
>people actually grow up playing football in many parts of the country (I
>understand its religon in the southern states)...

How many high schools don't have a football team? Baseball team?
Basketball team? Now how many high schools have a hockey team?
In most cases a think there is a direct relationship between exposure
to a particular sport and its popularity. Basically football,
basketball and baseball can or/almost be played year round at no
expense. OTOH even if you needed no equipment there is the IT expense
of hockey if there is even an rink available. I don't know what IT
runs these days, but when I lasted played about 15 years ago it was
$120/hr off hours at a municipal rink.
>
>Just a quick thought...which sport is more popular (through participation)
>with kids these days...football or hockey? Although I am sure soccer is
>blowing every other youth sport away...

Any stats to back up your assertion that soccer is blowing away every
other youth sport. I'd bet dollars to doughnuts that virtually every
boy has played organized and/or unorganized football. That certainly
can't be said of soccer. The only place that soccer might be "blowing
away" every sport might be with girls.
>
>Rich
>
>
>"nJb" <bobo1148 DeleteThis @xmission.com> wrote in message
>news:3F8D99FA.4126F5D2@xmission.com...
>> Diego wrote:
>> >
>> > I'm not from the United States and I have read about the low TV ratings,
>the
>> > financial problems and the lack of interest in NHL in the United States
>(I
>> > guess that not in Canada) but then I see the attendance figures and they
>> > seem very good. Media tend to show sports in a worst situation than the
>one
>> > they are in fact but anyway my question: in the United States do you
>think
>> > that NHL is one of the major sports or it's behind NFL, MLB and NBA?
>Please
>> > I'm only interested in knowing NHL's situation not the other sports'?
>Let's
>> > clarify something: considering that what I'm interested in is knowing
>aboput
>> > the entertainment industry part of sports I would like you to think that
>> > NASCAR, F1, Indy car and all those motor sports are included in the
>list, in
>> > addition please include College sports (not all as one but College
>football,
>> > college basketball, college baseball as different sports) and in
>baseball,
>> > you could include Minor Leagues too.
>> > Thanks.
>>
>>
>http://www.sportsfansofamerica.com/Interactive/Editorials/Fans/Popularity.htm
>>
>> Scroll down the page and you'll see that hockey is about as popular as a
>> chapped ass.
>> --
>> Jack
>>
>>
>> http://photos.yahoo.com/bc/xmissionbobo/
>
>
>---
>Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free.
>Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com).
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>
 >> Stay informed about: Is NHL one of the top four sports? 

peneny.RemoveThis@earthlink.net wrote in message news:<h4grovc1ro4rnli8ok340cbh0p7plqms0t.RemoveThis@4ax.com>...
..
..
..
> Any stats to back up your assertion that soccer is blowing away every
> other youth sport. I'd bet dollars to doughnuts that virtually every
> boy has played organized and/or unorganized football. That certainly
> can't be said of soccer. The only place that soccer might be "blowing
> away" every sport might be with girls.

In three area of the country I'm familiar with I would agree with the
previous poster, soccer easily rules in participation levels. But, if
you look at statistics that are actually maintained it seems that they
start at highschool teams. Doing a quick search it seems that your
correct that highschool participation levels are the highest ever with
football being at the top of the participation level. I'd say in the
three areas that I'm familiar with almost every child participates in
soccer from the age of 6-13 for some years, but by the time they get
to highschool a concentration of them make the team and continue and
by the time they make it to college another concentration of them make
the college level. At the same time, there is almost a "1:1
relationship" of football participation from peewee football to
highschool and then the concentration for continuing in the sport past
highschool. At the highschool level, team size is a huge factor in
these participation levels.

This is just an interesting topic to me due the impact of Title IX.
Basically the increase in the adoption of woman's sports programs that
have large numbers to offset the numbers of male athletes, expecially
football, at successfull universities.
 >> Stay informed about: Is NHL one of the top four sports? 

Not even close try #7

http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,100277,00.html
 >> Stay informed about: Is NHL one of the top four sports? 

Mark wrote:
>
> Not even close try #7
>
> http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,100277,00.html

That's a poll of what people think, not what is. 25% of those polled
thought the Cubs would win the World Series. They are wrong.

More people watch auto racing than any of those listed. It's likely even
more watch horse racing.
--
Jack
 >> Stay informed about: Is NHL one of the top four sports? 

In Canada the numbers are the exact opposite. Hockey is easily number
one. Sports like major league baseball and the NBA are so unpopular
they've been shoved to the cable channels. The NBA's TV ratigns are so
bad that reruns of those strong man competitions easily beat the
Raptors, or any NBA game, when they go head to head. I don't give
baseball or basketball much of a future in Canada. Because CAnadians
have shown they could give a rats butt about either. And lets face it.
Watching paint dry is more exciting than baseball.


On Wed, 15 Oct 2003 15:01:49 +0200, "Diego"
<arui30 RemoveThis @cerezo.pntic.mec.es> wrote:

>I'm not from the United States and I have read about the low TV ratings, the
>financial problems and the lack of interest in NHL in the United States (I
>guess that not in Canada) but then I see the attendance figures and they
>seem very good. Media tend to show sports in a worst situation than the one
>they are in fact but anyway my question: in the United States do you think
>that NHL is one of the major sports or it's behind NFL, MLB and NBA? Please
>I'm only interested in knowing NHL's situation not the other sports'? Let's
>clarify something: considering that what I'm interested in is knowing aboput
>the entertainment industry part of sports I would like you to think that
>NASCAR, F1, Indy car and all those motor sports are included in the list, in
>addition please include College sports (not all as one but College football,
>college basketball, college baseball as different sports) and in baseball,
>you could include Minor Leagues too.
>Thanks.
>
 >> Stay informed about: Is NHL one of the top four sports? 

My list would be NFL(Da' Bears), AHL/NHL(Wolves/Thrashers), F1 (Jaguar, too
bad about Montreal), MLB(White Sox)

"MelloYellow" <a.DeleteThis@one.com> wrote in message
news:9vcuovgijqp70gp42b8kdkhu7qm691ishv@4ax.com...
> In Canada the numbers are the exact opposite. Hockey is easily number
> one. Sports like major league baseball and the NBA are so unpopular
> they've been shoved to the cable channels. The NBA's TV ratigns are so
> bad that reruns of those strong man competitions easily beat the
> Raptors, or any NBA game, when they go head to head. I don't give
> baseball or basketball much of a future in Canada. Because CAnadians
> have shown they could give a rats butt about either. And lets face it.
> Watching paint dry is more exciting than baseball.
>
>
> On Wed, 15 Oct 2003 15:01:49 +0200, "Diego"
> <arui30.DeleteThis@cerezo.pntic.mec.es> wrote:
>
> >I'm not from the United States and I have read about the low TV ratings,
the
> >financial problems and the lack of interest in NHL in the United States
(I
> >guess that not in Canada) but then I see the attendance figures and they
> >seem very good. Media tend to show sports in a worst situation than the
one
> >they are in fact but anyway my question: in the United States do you
think
> >that NHL is one of the major sports or it's behind NFL, MLB and NBA?
Please
> >I'm only interested in knowing NHL's situation not the other sports'?
Let's
> >clarify something: considering that what I'm interested in is knowing
aboput
> >the entertainment industry part of sports I would like you to think that
> >NASCAR, F1, Indy car and all those motor sports are included in the list,
in
> >addition please include College sports (not all as one but College
football,
> >college basketball, college baseball as different sports) and in
baseball,
> >you could include Minor Leagues too.
> >Thanks.
> >
>
 >> Stay informed about: Is NHL one of the top four sports? 

in order:

hockey
baseball
college football
college basketball in march
pro football (rapidly sliding down into the last category)
everything else this side of soccer (communist sport...LOL!!!)
"Big John" <noone.TakeThisOut@nowhere.com> wrote in message
news:vASob.78160$Tr4.200414@attbi_s03...
> My list would be NFL(Da' Bears), AHL/NHL(Wolves/Thrashers), F1 (Jaguar,
too
> bad about Montreal), MLB(White Sox)
>
> "MelloYellow" <a.TakeThisOut@one.com> wrote in message
> news:9vcuovgijqp70gp42b8kdkhu7qm691ishv@4ax.com...
> > In Canada the numbers are the exact opposite. Hockey is easily number
> > one. Sports like major league baseball and the NBA are so unpopular
> > they've been shoved to the cable channels. The NBA's TV ratigns are so
> > bad that reruns of those strong man competitions easily beat the
> > Raptors, or any NBA game, when they go head to head. I don't give
> > baseball or basketball much of a future in Canada. Because CAnadians
> > have shown they could give a rats butt about either. And lets face it.
> > Watching paint dry is more exciting than baseball.
> >
> >
> > On Wed, 15 Oct 2003 15:01:49 +0200, "Diego"
> > <arui30.TakeThisOut@cerezo.pntic.mec.es> wrote:
> >
> > >I'm not from the United States and I have read about the low TV
ratings,
> the
> > >financial problems and the lack of interest in NHL in the United States
> (I
> > >guess that not in Canada) but then I see the attendance figures and
they
> > >seem very good. Media tend to show sports in a worst situation than the
> one
> > >they are in fact but anyway my question: in the United States do you
> think
> > >that NHL is one of the major sports or it's behind NFL, MLB and NBA?
> Please
> > >I'm only interested in knowing NHL's situation not the other sports'?
> Let's
> > >clarify something: considering that what I'm interested in is knowing
> aboput
> > >the entertainment industry part of sports I would like you to think
that
> > >NASCAR, F1, Indy car and all those motor sports are included in the
list,
> in
> > >addition please include College sports (not all as one but College
> football,
> > >college basketball, college baseball as different sports) and in
> baseball,
> > >you could include Minor Leagues too.
> > >Thanks.
> > >
> >
>
>
 >> Stay informed about: Is NHL one of the top four sports? 

[follow-ups set to Rec.sport.hockey, where the following
reply was made earlier today from the Rangers board - gld]


Dear Diego,

Diego wrote:

> I'm not from the United States and I have read about the low TV
> ratings, the
> financial problems and the lack of interest in NHL in the United States (I
> guess that not in Canada) but then I see the attendance figures and they
> seem very good. Media tend to show sports in a worst situation than
> the one
> they are in fact but anyway my question: in the United States do you think
> that NHL is one of the major sports or it's behind NFL, MLB and NBA?
>


I'm expanding your reply to rec.sport.hockey since it is of a more general
nature, not restricted to the New York Rangers.

The NHL is a major professional sport, and it's behind the NFL, MLB and NBA
in the United States. However, it failed to become the 4th-most popular US
major sport - which was the objective of what may become known as the
Bettman Bubble of the mid-90's/early 2000's.

NHL teams are highly dependent on ticket revenues, moreso than any of the
other major pro leagues. The drop in attendance severely impacts the bottom
line. In the US (less so in Canada), franchises have benefited from
state and
local government subsidies and with most of them badly in the red, the NHL
teams cannot renegotiate concessions nor rely on prospects of public funds
for a new arena. The Pittsburgh Penguins are caught in such a squeeze ...
last in attendance, and terrible public ledgers all but officially
closing doors
on corporate welfare for a new arena. The NHL has also run out of places
in the US for expansion or team relocation. I just moved to Portland,
Oregon
which had had been speculated as the destination for as many as eight NHL
franchises. To put it bluntly ... Oregon, and Portland in particular,
is too poor
for the NHL. The "grass roots" lobbying organization, NHL2PDX, actually
run by a part time civil servant has folded. Owner-candidate Paul Allen
has lost nearly half his net worth (down to $22 Billion from $40 Billion)
and is spending his energy and dollars to maintain his NBA Trailblazers.
With a $100 Million salary budget, they are $50 Million over the NBA
salary cap which exacts an additional $50 Million fine. Paul Allen has
been in Portland with his yacht to throw parties (including a one hour
set with his band, he's a very good guitar player who idolizes Hendrix)
for his luxury box subscribers, especially those sitting on the fence ...
he never did that in the past.

http://www.portlandtribune.com/ (search with "Paul Allen yacht")

With only ESPN for NHL hockey in Portland, I now feel the impact
of low NHL ratings. ESPN2 has 50 games, like last year while ESPN
and ABC will have fewer than last year. Back in Chicago, there was
also local coverage of Blackhawks road games on FoxSports Chicago
and a few more games on the main channels. DIS overpaid for NHL,
even if you believed in rosy scenarioes that made the Bettman Bubble.
$600 Million for five years ... $120 a year. Fox's previous contract
was (I believe) $50 Million per year. A bad sign, early one, was that
Fox offered their final year to Disney/ABC/ESPN for $50 Million,
but were turned down! And the people who created the deal for
Disney were fired shortly afterward.

How bad is it? Yesterday, Saturday, November 1, between NCAA
college football games, ESPN and ESPN2's mid-afternoon (Pacific),
late afternoon (Eastern/Central) schedule feature poker, lawn mower
races, and "school bus figure 8" (what's THAT?) when a NHL game
could have been tucked into one or both channels. (tv.yahoo.com)

Whether there is a lockout or not, the NHL will probably have
to accept a new deal with Disney/ABC/ESPN for $1 in order to
preserve its coverage for whatever teams are left. But sadly,
the more likely outcome is that there won't be an ESPN $1
deal but rather, something like $30 Million/five years with
Spike TV, paid in installments in case that Spike is spiked,
and Pam Anderson's "Stripperella" shown between periods.

gld
 >> Stay informed about: Is NHL one of the top four sports? 

I really enjoy hockey, even though they have had these financial situations
I don't think its really going to change if your a hockey fan then you will
always be one
"Diego" <arui30.DeleteThis@cerezo.pntic.mec.es> wrote in message
news:bmjgfu$n8ku2$1@ID-112298.news.uni-berlin.de...
> I'm not from the United States and I have read about the low TV ratings,
> the
> financial problems and the lack of interest in NHL in the United States (I
> guess that not in Canada) but then I see the attendance figures and they
> seem very good. Media tend to show sports in a worst situation than the
> one
> they are in fact but anyway my question: in the United States do you think
> that NHL is one of the major sports or it's behind NFL, MLB and NBA?
> Please
> I'm only interested in knowing NHL's situation not the other sports'?
> Let's
> clarify something: considering that what I'm interested in is knowing
> aboput
> the entertainment industry part of sports I would like you to think that
> NASCAR, F1, Indy car and all those motor sports are included in the list,
> in
> addition please include College sports (not all as one but College
> football,
> college basketball, college baseball as different sports) and in baseball,
> you could include Minor Leagues too.
> Thanks.
>
>
 >> Stay informed about: Is NHL one of the top four sports?