Nice win?

On Oct 21, 9:27 pm, Duane <letskee... DeleteThis @posting4now.com> wrote:
> I just got back from another time out of town, and was surprised to
> see a few (negative) comments concerning the Detroit game, but nothing
> about Nashville. Interesting. It is as if our little NG has gone
> back to the old days, when the Sharks really did have a bad team,
> worthy of bitching and not much else, and then after that, the Sutter
> era, where the Sharks were not elite, but always getting that #8 seed.
> Pessimism reigns...
>
> No matter. I saw both games, and I thought the Sharks had too many
> passengers in the former, and a couple even in the latter. I don't
> really see where criticism of Wilson is warranted, but I know the same
> writer has made the same statement many times now, and feels a need to
> defend the point. I thought Wilson made all the right moves, in
> particular with benching Goc during the Detroit game, and then
> sky-boxing him for the Nashville one. I still think he is too quick
> to change lines, but otherwise the play is really in the domain of the
> players...
>
> As for the Nashville game, I thought Nabby played awesome, especially
> in the first period, and that saved their bacon. Their defense is
> playing better than expected, at least from my POV. Leading the NHL
> in assists with 20? You have to like that. Any disappointment is
> with the star-studded forward group which seemingly is incapable of
> making a tape to tape pass, much less crashing the net. Otherwise,
> the effort was there on both ends of the ice, and they got the result.
>
> Wrt Detroit, the bad Ellis goal seemed to deflate the Sharks, and they
> just never got their mojo back. Same old problem. This needs to be
> addressed, but I am not sure how. Would a fire and brimstone coach
> help them with this particular problem? Doubtful. You'd really have
> to trade the key guys to address this one. So I think maybe what they
> need to do is work on their third line, trade Brown, Goc, Riss,
> whoever, and bring in someone with sandpaper, as Wilson would say. I
> honestly don't know the answer, but I doubt that dropping Wilson,
> while keeping the same team, would help at all.

That "same writer" feels no need to "defend" anything. This team's
consistently uninspiring performances, versus their supposed
potential, does all his speaking for him.

The problem with looking at the Sharks' recent records, or their
stats, of their consistent playoff appearances is that it all means
near nothing when it comes to really having what it takes to compete
at Cup levels. That they can roll up a hundred points in a season,
while playing intermittently good hockey, just adds emphasis to how
embarrasing their lack of focus and intensity is in comparison to
their raw talent.

Either we have a team with little character, when it counts, and/or
the coach isn't able to impart a sense of mission and desire in the
club, and publicly complains when he's failed to do it. To me, this
gets rather old. This isn't the expansion years, anymore. I'm not
interested in reliably making the playoffs each year, I'm interested
in seeing them hoist the Cup. And I think they need a coach who can
command more respect and get the players to deliver that extra effort
when it's critical. Ron Wilson has demonstrated over three seasons
that he lacks this knack. The team won't stay competitive forever, so
striking when the opportunity exists is vital.

Regarding the two games, they looked pitiful, outclassed and,
ultimately, mentally defeated against Detroit, but they did handle
Nashville relatively well, although it should be mentioned that
Nashiville has lost five straight, so the Sharks shouldn't schedule a
downtown parade, just yet.

Nabby, for all the complaints leveled against him and his contract,
from time to time, has been the Sharks' best player, so far this year,
in my estimation.

The Sharks seem to follow a pattern in play and demeanor each year,
and until that pattern changes, the results are likely to remain the
same. As the old expression goes, "one form of insanity is doing the
same thing over and over and expecting different results."
 >> Stay informed about: Nice win? 

On Sun, 21 Oct 2007 20:48:26 -0700, tack <thetacker.DeleteThis@gmail.com> wrote:
>That "same writer" feels no need to "defend" anything. This team's
>consistently uninspiring performances, versus their supposed
>potential, does all his speaking for him.
>
>The problem with looking at the Sharks' recent records, or their
>stats, of their consistent playoff appearances is that it all means
>near nothing when it comes to really having what it takes to compete
>at Cup levels. That they can roll up a hundred points in a season,
>while playing intermittently good hockey, just adds emphasis to how
>embarrasing their lack of focus and intensity is in comparison to
>their raw talent.
>
>Either we have a team with little character, when it counts, and/or
>the coach isn't able to impart a sense of mission and desire in the
>club, and publicly complains when he's failed to do it. To me, this
>gets rather old. This isn't the expansion years, anymore. I'm not
>interested in reliably making the playoffs each year, I'm interested
>in seeing them hoist the Cup. And I think they need a coach who can
>command more respect and get the players to deliver that extra effort
>when it's critical. Ron Wilson has demonstrated over three seasons
>that he lacks this knack. The team won't stay competitive forever, so
>striking when the opportunity exists is vital.
>
>Regarding the two games, they looked pitiful, outclassed and,
>ultimately, mentally defeated against Detroit, but they did handle
>Nashville relatively well, although it should be mentioned that
>Nashiville has lost five straight, so the Sharks shouldn't schedule a
>downtown parade, just yet.
>
>Nabby, for all the complaints leveled against him and his contract,
>from time to time, has been the Sharks' best player, so far this year,
>in my estimation.
>
>The Sharks seem to follow a pattern in play and demeanor each year,
>and until that pattern changes, the results are likely to remain the
>same. As the old expression goes, "one form of insanity is doing the
>same thing over and over and expecting different results."

I like that you say you don't need to defend your point, and then you
defend it anyway, Tack! Anyway, I'm just messin' with you. This NG
doesn't lack "sandpaper"...

I'm on record saying that if the Sharks can't take it to the next
level by the end of this season -- and I don't mean in the playoffs, I
mean consistency game to game, playing at a high level -- then I think
Wilson should be fired. I would only favor firing him mid-season if
it is clear that the players have tuned him out. DW is in a good
position to judge this, and I am not, and neither are you, unless you
have a secret inside job driving the zamboni with the Sharks or
something like that (and if so, your ice is pathetic! Get it
together, man!).

Here's what you should be asking. Do the Sharks have a reasonable
game plan given their particular set of talents? I say yes. They are
well suited to be a forechecking team given their size and skill up
front, ala Anaheim. Is the coach getting the most out of the younger
players? Again, I would say yes, especially on defense. Wilson
trusts these guys, and works them in the lineup in a way that gives
them confidence, without hurting the team so much. Outside of Brad
Boyes, who got just one game with the Sharks, I can't think of another
player who has come up the last few years who the Sharks have given up
on, who has shined with another team. Is he seemingly fair? Again, I
would say yes. Guys who aren't bringing it are quickly benched during
a game. As for past success, Wilson took an inferior (in my view) US
team to the world championships over Canada, and that team was just
awesome. He's an offensively minded coach, and his systems are sound,
in my opinion. When the Sharks are playing it well, I like their
style of play.

All that said, this has not been a great beginning by any means,
especially among the forward group. Besides Brown, Goc, and Riss,
Bernier has still not regained his rookie form, and Clowe looks to me
to be in a Sophomore slump. Cheechoo has not played well for the most
part. Pav looks OK, JR has been as good as could be expected, Grier
gives an honest effort every game, and Marleau, Michalek and Joe have
been good. I'd demote Mitchell for the time being, and bring back
Setoguchi if he is recovered from his injury. Mitchell isn't playing
badly, but he's not scoring and the Sharks need goals.

I think this team will heat up soon. Its still early. A few more
home games would help! And yes, the have lost two of three at home,
but one was the Detroit game, and the other was to Boston, who they
outplayed. November is a much more favorable schedule, 4 against LA
(3 at home) and 3 against Phx (2 at home).
 >> Stay informed about: Nice win? 

On Sun, 21 Oct 2007 18:27:21 -0700, Duane <letskeepit.TakeThisOut@posting4now.com>
wrote:

>I just got back from another time out of town, and was surprised to
>see a few (negative) comments concerning the Detroit game, but nothing
>about Nashville.

I wasn't, not really.

I stayed over at a friend's house Saturday night. Got home, did some
stuff, checked my newsgroups. Saw no comment about any game here,
thought "Hang on, there was a game last night. Ah, the Sharks must
have won".
 >> Stay informed about: Nice win? 

On Oct 21, 6:27 pm, Duane <letskee....TakeThisOut@posting4now.com> wrote:
> I just got back from another time out of town, and was surprised to
> see a few (negative) comments concerning the Detroit game, but nothing
> about Nashville. Interesting. It is as if our little NG has gone
> back to the old days, when the Sharks really did have a bad team,
> worthy of bitching and not much else, and then after that, the Sutter
> era, where the Sharks were not elite, but always getting that #8 seed.
> Pessimism reigns...
>
> No matter. I saw both games, and I thought the Sharks had too many
> passengers in the former, and a couple even in the latter. I don't
> really see where criticism of Wilson is warranted, but I know the same
> writer has made the same statement many times now, and feels a need to
> defend the point. I thought Wilson made all the right moves, in
> particular with benching Goc during the Detroit game, and then
> sky-boxing him for the Nashville one. I still think he is too quick
> to change lines, but otherwise the play is really in the domain of the
> players...
>
> As for the Nashville game, I thought Nabby played awesome, especially
> in the first period, and that saved their bacon. Their defense is
> playing better than expected, at least from my POV. Leading the NHL
> in assists with 20? You have to like that. Any disappointment is
> with the star-studded forward group which seemingly is incapable of
> making a tape to tape pass, much less crashing the net. Otherwise,
> the effort was there on both ends of the ice, and they got the result.
>
> Wrt Detroit, the bad Ellis goal seemed to deflate the Sharks, and they
> just never got their mojo back. Same old problem. This needs to be
> addressed, but I am not sure how. Would a fire and brimstone coach
> help them with this particular problem? Doubtful. You'd really have
> to trade the key guys to address this one. So I think maybe what they
> need to do is work on their third line, trade Brown, Goc, Riss,
> whoever, and bring in someone with sandpaper, as Wilson would say. I
> honestly don't know the answer, but I doubt that dropping Wilson,
> while keeping the same team, would help at all.

For my part I was pretty clear that I was very happy with the
goaltending and defense. Hopefully that will continue, which will keep
them in many games. The offense looks completely disorganized.

Also, to fully disclose, by pure chance I have been out of town and
not seen the vancouver win, or the preds win. But hey, any one can
beat the preds, right? I have also skipped a couple other games,
because IMO the offense just isn't worth the time spent to watch the
game.

I agree completely that I like the moves RW has made, and don't think
for a minute that a new coach would necessarily be able to cure their
ills. And also agree about RW's incessant line jumbling.
 >> Stay informed about: Nice win? 

"Mr. T" <ted.pederson.RemoveThis@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:1193074251.482841.18090@i38g2000prf.googlegroups.com...
> On Oct 21, 6:27 pm, Duane <letskee....RemoveThis@posting4now.com> wrote:
>> I just got back from another time out of town, and was surprised to
>> see a few (negative) comments concerning the Detroit game, but nothing
>> about Nashville. Interesting. It is as if our little NG has gone
>> back to the old days, when the Sharks really did have a bad team,
>> worthy of bitching and not much else, and then after that, the Sutter
>> era, where the Sharks were not elite, but always getting that #8 seed.
>> Pessimism reigns...
>>
>> No matter. I saw both games, and I thought the Sharks had too many
>> passengers in the former, and a couple even in the latter. I don't
>> really see where criticism of Wilson is warranted, but I know the same
>> writer has made the same statement many times now, and feels a need to
>> defend the point. I thought Wilson made all the right moves, in
>> particular with benching Goc during the Detroit game, and then
>> sky-boxing him for the Nashville one. I still think he is too quick
>> to change lines, but otherwise the play is really in the domain of the
>> players...
>>
>> As for the Nashville game, I thought Nabby played awesome, especially
>> in the first period, and that saved their bacon. Their defense is
>> playing better than expected, at least from my POV. Leading the NHL
>> in assists with 20? You have to like that. Any disappointment is
>> with the star-studded forward group which seemingly is incapable of
>> making a tape to tape pass, much less crashing the net. Otherwise,
>> the effort was there on both ends of the ice, and they got the result.
>>
>> Wrt Detroit, the bad Ellis goal seemed to deflate the Sharks, and they
>> just never got their mojo back. Same old problem. This needs to be
>> addressed, but I am not sure how. Would a fire and brimstone coach
>> help them with this particular problem? Doubtful. You'd really have
>> to trade the key guys to address this one. So I think maybe what they
>> need to do is work on their third line, trade Brown, Goc, Riss,
>> whoever, and bring in someone with sandpaper, as Wilson would say. I
>> honestly don't know the answer, but I doubt that dropping Wilson,
>> while keeping the same team, would help at all.
>
> For my part I was pretty clear that I was very happy with the
> goaltending and defense. Hopefully that will continue, which will keep
> them in many games. The offense looks completely disorganized.
>
> Also, to fully disclose, by pure chance I have been out of town and
> not seen the vancouver win, or the preds win. But hey, any one can
> beat the preds, right?

Anyone should beat them, with that gutted lineup. But the offense managed
only one decent goal, plus a softy and an empty netter.

Still waiting on RW's magic line-making machine to find a couple that click.
 >> Stay informed about: Nice win?